Hellboy II: The Golden Army

Who wouldn’t miss this face?

Having liked the first movie so much, it was only natural that I would see the sequel, but I was quickly disappointed to learn that my favorite character from the first movie, John Meyers (played by the adorable Rupert Evans), was not to reappear. We learn in this one that Hellboy had him transferred to Antarctica (That’s a snow movie I would enjoy watching.)

One minute he’s handing you a gun, the next minute he’s sending you to the antarctic pole to keep you away from his girl

We also lose David Hyde Pierce as the voice of Abraham Sapien – you probably won’t care too much because his replacement Doug Jones does a fine job of mimicking his vocal patterns, though it still feels like a blow. Plus, there’s no promise of romance at all in the movie (or so we think…) seeing as how Liz and Hellboy are already a couple when the movie begins (despite the fact that their hookup is ambiguous at the end of the first film…in my opinion).

Hellboy’s all right as far as characters go, though not really much in terms of superheroes, if you ask me. I like that he likes cats (there’s a great part in Hellboy 2 where he stops a troll from eating a cat even though he was ordered not to…maybe you’ll have to see it for yourself in order to appreciate it as an awww moment). And I like how much he loves his “father” and looks out for agents Flint, Steel, and Marble. And Ron Perlman does a fantastic job. But, honestly, he’s not an attractive guy, and I don’t care for his irreverent attitude. He’s not an idealist (even Del Toro points this out in his commentary), which isn’t a characteristic I truly appreciated in my heroes until it was gone.

A picture from the only scene in the movie when they’re not at each other’s throats

In the first movie I was pretty set on Liz Sherman (played by Selma Blair…an actress I’ve never much cared for…which probably has something to do with all of the immature, whiny characters she has played, like in Cruel Intentions and Lies and Alibis) being with the aforementioned John Meyers, even though he was presented merely as an obstacle to the unseemly love of Liz and Hellboy. I just don’t like the two of them as a couple. Even if I put aside my disgust at their interspecies romance (and she’s pregnant in the second one!), I don’t enjoy their time together, where all they do if fight. Not the love-hate banter which I always savor as an expression of suppressed sexual desire in many couples, but just plain old fighting like a married couple who doesn’t hold anything back and doesn’t even really seem to like each other anymore. Their fighting grates on me. All that interests me is a kind of base curiosity as to whether or not their child will have a tail and horns.

Luke Goss

Well, that’s my two cents. You may be asking at this point where the brother and sister are. Well, there aren’t any. Just kidding! I wouldn’t pull another The Vampire Diaries on you again so soon. In fact, this entry will resemble Cadavres more – in that incestuous feelings are heavily implied, and are not figments of my active and twisted imagination. And, in case you question my reliability in that respect, I can offer you confirmation from director Guillermo del Toro and actor Luke Goss. I didn’t listen to all of the DVD commentary because I didn’t want to hear things that I didn’t want to hear (ignorance is bliss), but I listened to enough to get official corroboration. The fact that the movie was listed on Television Tropes and Idioms’ page for Brother-Sister Incest was my first clue; and also the reason why I in the end bothered to watch it. It also seems to be the only thing I liked about it (aside from the message about the environment and some fun special effects. Oh, and the baby that was really a tumor. Hee! That got me.)

You may also at this point be complaining that you don’t care what my opinion on Hellboy is. Well, I’ve got good news for you. I’m done with Hellboy. That’s right, the brother and sister in question are not the main characters of the film. They belong to the “Golden Army” part of the title.

You may have noticed from the title of this post that my recommendation is tentative. Well, that’s because I don’t think this movie is great. But the brother-sister relationship I’m going to talk about, the brother-sister relationship which got me to watch this movie in the first place, is great enough to warrant sitting through the rest of it. You know, if you’re into that kind of thing, which obviously I am. And especially if you use the VLC media player (like I do) which allows you to watch a movie at any speed of your choice, and which allowed me to watch the boring parts at 2x. The rest of the movie, which is to say, the Hellboy part, is lackluster. The Liz/Hellboy scenes were off-putting, as you can imagine, due to the negative feelings they stir in me. The humor was tired: the jokes were good the first time around (which is to say, in the first movie). And as much as I love Jeffrey Tambor (from his brilliant work on the brilliant Arrested Development), such was the case for his character as well. Bottom line: see the first movie for Hellboy, see this one for Princess Nuala and Prince Nuada.

This girl needs to step out of the forest and get a little sun

Wherever he was in exile, it must have been underground. It certainly wasn’t L.A.

Well, my latest entry about Phineas and Ferb added to the diversity of subjects I have been handling in that it is a cartoon, and in that the male(s) in question are younger than high school age. I’m crossing into new territory today as well: the brother and sister of which I am going to write are…not human. That’s right. They are…Elvin (elfin?), I believe. Some manner of elf-like creature. Exciting, right? They are more human like that Santa’s elves, but less human-like than the elves of Tolkien. They have white hair and very white (almost bluish) skin, and yellow eyes. That’s about all that makes them different. Elf royalty have lines on their faces, I’m not sure what that’s about except to make them cooler than everyone else.

It’s time for a plot summary! I’m going to lay it out bare. So, spoiler warning and all that. It’s all rather predictable, if you ask me. But not in a bad way.

So, there is a legend about a golden army. A long time ago, everyone lived together: elves, humans, and all manner of other creatures. But humans were pits of insatiable greed, and this, as you can imagine, caused some discord. The elves and the humans battled, and the humans did pretty well. So the elf king (sorry, I forgot his name), (after an offer from the forger and at the behest of his son, Nuada), had a golden army forged and one ring to rule them all…wait, I’m getting mixed up. It was a crown that controlled the army. Anyone of royal blood (this is important, so remember it!) can wear the crown and wield the Golden Army. Well, the Golden Army crushes the humans like dry leave beneath their feet. The king is overcome with remorse, and makes a pact with the humans: the humans will stay in their urban centers, and will hold onto 1/3 of the crown. The elves will stay in the forest and hold onto the other 2/3. The king’s son, Prince Nuada, is not a supporter of this treaty, so he runs off to live in exile, vowing to return when the elves will need him most. Well, he does return and not a moment too soon. In fact, one has to wonder why he didn’t appear around the time of the industrial revolution.

He steals the human third of the crown as its being auctioned off, slaughtering everyone in the auction house using tooth fairies (and not of the Rock/Dwayne Johnson variety, and most especially not him in a pink dress).

He then returns to court. Even though the elves agree that the situation with the humans is dismal, they would rather fade away that reawaken the army and its horrors. Nuada is unwilling to yield is position, so his father (an honorable “man”) is forced to punish his son in the capital sort of way (even though this will also kill his daughter, as you will learn).

Nuada’s sister, Nuala, agrees with their father. Well, Nuada isn’t having any of that. He kills his father and enough of the royal guard to take control of the room. I know what you’re thinking: brrr; patricide, that is ice cold! Well, yeah. But you can see that Nuada doesn’t really want to do it and loves his father. He feels he has to and it is in some ways self defense at this point. So, he takes the crown piece from his father, but Nuala has the last third, and she flees.

It’s getting good, right?

This is the best he will ever look…because he is almost entirely covered in black rubber

Well, Nuala runs into Abraham Sapien, the aquatic member of Hellboy’s team, and he proceeds to fall helplessly in love with her. She clearly likes him – he’s a nice guy, sensitive, not human, likes poetry – but if you ask me, liking him back is just another way of running away. You don’t find gills sexy unless there’s something else going on. Plus they do some sort of telepathic exchange where he learns her story and she learns just about everything about him and everything that he knows. I suppose it’s easy to care about someone when you’ve gone through something like that with them.

Nuala explains that she and Nuada are twins. And more than that: they’re linked. “I can’t explain it,” she says. Awesome! It would be exciting enough if all elf twins were like that, but we’re looking at some kind of anomaly here.  Squeeeeee!!!!

Oh, my nose!

And oh my nose too!

They can’t read each other’s minds exactly, but they come very close to it. And whatever happens to her body happens to his, and vice verse. They only show this in terms of wounds and hurt, but how can you have pain without pleasure? The scope of the film and mainstream release didn’t allow us to explore the question further. Nuala also explains that Nuada will always find her (they don’t have to touch to communicate the way that Nuala and Abe did.)

Well, she’s right! And it’s very exciting. She can feel him coming, and though she runs and hides the crown piece and burns the map to the resting place of the Golden Army, the first thing she does is hold up palm and close her eyes. It’s like, she wants him to find her, but she doesn’t want it. Her love for him is never in question, but she’s simply too good to allow him to carry out his plan. She’s an idealist too, like her father, just not the same kind as Nuada. Their ideals are not the same. No, they are. They differ on one point, really.

I’ll call you Scruffy.

Well, Nuada kills the guards without impunity, but he’s sweet to the dogs. It’s hard not to like him when he does stuff like that. As a treehugger, a large part of me would have enjoyed watching him bringing everyone to their knees. He’s a conservationist, essentially.

Nuada reads Nuala pretty easily, but he’s interrupted before he finds the crown piece. He kidnaps his sister (tricky business when everything you do to her happens to you), and demands the crown piece in exchange. He also injures Hellboy in a way that will require his help to fix him, and then makes his demand for the crown piece. I’m still not quite sure why he thinks that plan will work, but it does. Because Abe, like Liz, and like Hellboy, is not an idealist. He’ll try to stop Nuada, but he’d sacrifice the whole world to save Nuala, against her wishes and common sense. Liz is on the same page. I don’t admire that kind of sacrifice. (Well, maybe I do a little bit. I’m just too pragmatic for it.)

Sister, do you like my new tiara?

Well, the final battle takes place in Ireland (score another point for the elves and Nuada) at the resting place of the Golden Army. Abe Sapien, smitten, steals the crown piece and gives it in exchange for Nuala’s life. Nuada puts the three pieces together, awakens the army, and is about to wreak havoc when the pesky Hellboy challenges his right to control the crown. You have to read the fine print, but Hellboy is apparently of royal descent in that hell dimension from which he hails, so the challenge must be met. Nuala is of little help to Nuada and my cause in this scene, encouraging Hellboy’s rebellion. But her agenda is still the same: stop the Golden Army. It’s not like she’s worried that Nuada will be killed in the fight: Abe knows that any harm that comes to Nuada will come to his sister, so he mandates that Hellboy not kill Nuada. The fact that she encourages the fight is not indicative of her feelings towards Nuada. He has to be stopped; it’s got nothing to do with how much she loves him.

An earlier example of Nuada’s badassery

So, they fight. Nuada is a bad ass fighter, even though he has to use a weapon when Hellboy doesn’t. In a fair fight (perhaps in an elegant fight, I mean), Nuada would have won. He won earlier, though Hellboy was drunk and knew he couldn’t hurt Nuada because it would hurt Nuala too. But Hellboy employs guerrilla techniques, and being basically a rock, he’s not easily defeated. Nuada is more skilled, but Hellboy does win the fight (foul, I say!). He spares Nuada as he has been instructed, and in fact, I don’t think Hellboy hates Nuada. Nuada is not a traditional villain: he’s not evil. He’s just a little ruthless. He has a contrary agenda, even though his agenda might in some ways be right. And when he preaches on the ingratitude and intolerance of humans he hits some real notes with Hellboy.

Well, Nuada doesn’t consider himself defeated even though Hellboy is already putting the crown on (again, foul I say!), but Nuala sees him coming up from behind and stabs herself in order to stop her brother. She feels it necessary to go for the kill shot; I guess she felt like a leg or an eye wouldn’t do the job, or maybe she’s like Jackie-O in The House of Yes: “I never meant to maim you, I only meant to kill you.” Maybe she’d rather see herself and her brother dead than maimed. She joins Angele and Jackie-O in the if-your-brother-is-going-somewhere-and-you-don’t-want-him-to-go-then-you-should-kill-him club, but she’s the only one to kill herself in the process. This is either a selfless act, or a selfish act. This way she gets to begin eternity with him.

I’m sure I mentioned my rule of thumb: character death is sad, but if both in the pairing die, it’s about a billion times less sad. I’m a firm believer in the Christian afterlife, and a firm believer that that means being with the ones you love.  Normally I would consider the death of only one in a pairing to be extremely bad, a real blow to shipping, but that doesn’t really count with movies like Cadavres and The House of Yes because it was murder, and sometimes murder is the most sincere expression of love. It’s not right, or totally sane, but in a fictional context it can be extremely romantic. Like a murder/suicide (as one might call this Nuala/Nuada outcome), only without the suicide in Angele and Jackie-O’s case. The act of killing someone you love is a sort of suicide. Perhaps Nuala’s death is the perfect and immaculate manifestation of this.

Well, Nuala’s final moment is with Abe, where she allows him to confess his love (but does not confess her own, note!). Nuada manages to stand a few moments longer: he gives a warning to Hellboy and then turns to his sister.  And then turns to stone (as their father did and as Nuala does). I like the stone thing. It reminds me of The Queen of the Damned.

Clearly he took his weights into exile with him

Well, I don’t think I need to say that I ship Nuala and Nuada. I’m sure you realize that that’s a given. He’s kind of frightening to look at. I know I’ve mentioned that I’m not really a long hair kind of girl. The pasty skin and freaky eyes are also not points in his favor. But in the case of this movie, that was not an issue. He was a fierce warrior, and had a good strong voice and manner, all of which compensated for his looks successfully. And it’s not like he wasn’t ripped. Besides, I didn’t want him for myself, I wanted him for Nuala.

Nuala, on the other hand, was quite enchanting. Probably because she’s the good twin they didn’t go so much for the just-crawled-out-of-Hell look. The actress (Anna Walton) is 12 years younger than Luke Goss’ Nuada, which might also have something to do with it.

The lovely (and British!) Anna Walton

I feel sad when you’re sad, and I feel glad when you’re glad…

Now, I realize from this no-frills plot summary, the incest subtext isn’t immediately obvious. The symbiotic/connected thing might give a person (me) some ideas, but it’s not necessarily indicative of unwholesome desire. Well, never fear. This is the part where I go into a little more detail.

The story behind the Golden Army is digitally animated using strange figurines. However, Nuala and Nuada are still indicated. We see Nuala looking at Nuada as he exiles himself. It’s rather interesting that they chose to show that instead of Nuada giving Nuala a look before walking off.

The next time we see them together, Nuada is coming to court. He guards demand that he surrender his weapon before entering, and he refuses, but then his sister appears and repeats the request in sweet way, and he says, “For you, sister, anything.” Can I just say that I love the way he says “anything”. Um, I don’t know, it’s just fabulous. It also sounds incredibly sincere. And suggestive…But apparently it’s not true, unless all of the events of the movie could have been averted if Nuala had simply said, “Brother, please do not awaken the Golden Army.” I guess we’ll never know.

She bows her head to him and then looks up with this diabolical smile…very out of character. I imagine she’s thinking that she’s going to get laid.

He ignores her while at court. The father does too: it’s hard to imagine that he would sentence his son to death knowing that it would kill his beloved, virtuous daughter as well. I guess elves take no prisoners. Nuada doesn’t look at her once while he takes the court over and fights the guards, even though he knew she didn’t support him. So either he could sense that she wasn’t doing anything, or he knew that she wouldn’t do anything. He seems moderately surprised that she’s run off. I was surprised he didn’t chase her himself. She wears very burdensome kimono-like garbs that would surely have inhibited her running. So she can’t run, she can’t hide, but he doesn’t go after her and instead prolongs her capture? No matter.

I’ll talk about their clothes now, which match a little bit. The director points out in the commentary that during the fight scene in the library, Nuada and Hellboy are a bit red, and Abe and Nuala are blue, but I thought it wasn’t very noticeable. Nuala and Nuada’s attire was a lot more matching than the color play (yes, I know that sentence is bad grammar, but that’s how I want to say it). Nuala remains in her royal elf garb. I guess she knows there’s no point in hiding. But considering the fact that the elf royalty have matching outfits, Nuala not changing is almost like a symbol of unity. Do you see what I’m trying to say? If not, it’s because my point is very weak.

In the first scene of her, at court, she and Nuada are in matching outfits, colors included. She changes out of the red into the blue for her scenes with Hellboy and team. Then she and Nuada have changed into the royal tan outfits for the finale. Hmmm…well, we don’t know what happened during the time it took them to get from Washington D.C. (right? Or is it New York?) to Ireland, but we do know they’re not wearing the same clothes (wink, wink).

Nuada appears on  scene just as Abe in introducing Nuala to Hellboy. He doesn’t pay much attention to his sister; he is much more concerned with winning the fight. He throws a green-colored bean at Hellboy, which as you can imagine doesn’t scare him too much. (Oh, God, not a green bean! Pink or blue or purple, but not green!) But Nuala knows what it is: en elemental, a forest God. The bean reaches water and grows into a giant stalk with swatting arms. It causes some real traffic problems, but I’m still not sure it was very scary.

Nuada becomes a devil on Hellboy’s shoulder, tempting him not to shoot it. It’s the last of its kind. It’s beautiful. But Hellboy does what he has to. As soon as it’s done, it’s hard not to wonder whether it was a mistake. The stalk puts down roots and becomes a giant tree spreading flora around the city block. It’s quite beautiful, and perhaps a reminder how much more beautiful nature is than city buildings.

Nuada and Abe have their scene once they escape back to Headquarters, talking about poetry and whatnot. But they separate for whatever reason, and Nuala retires alone while Abe sits up talking to Hellboy about how much he loves Nuala and mooning after her. It’s kind of richly and rewardingly ironic that Abe sits around singing Barry Manilow’s “Can’t Smile Without You” when it’s so much more appropriate a song for Nuada and Nuala.

This is when he get our moment of Nuada arriving. Nuala is sitting on her bed. She looks up, stands up, then extends her hand out in front of her, palm open and forward, and she closes her eyes as we hear Nuada whisper her name. It’s lovely. I really do get this sense that she wants to see him, but she has to stop him, which means she has to keep the crown piece from him. When she tells Abe that Nuada will find her – “he always does” – she certainly isn’t too cut up about it. It’s not that she’s resigned.

Well, Nuada finds her alone in the library and everyone else is unaware that he is there. This is probably the best scene between them. I don’t even really know how to go about describing it, the way they are with each other. It certainly doesn’t seem like Nuada has been in exile for millennia. I can only assume he’s been back to visit. He knows she hit the crown piece in a blue book, but he doesn’t know which one. He tells her she always looked so beautiful in blue. He strokes her cheek, and she doesn’t recoil…in fact, she closes her eyes again. I don’t care what anyone else says, that confirms for me all I need to know: being touched by him was pleasurable for her. Sometimes stroking a cheek is done as an act of intimidation (the episode Superstar of Buffy the Vampire Slayer and the scene in the graveyard between Spike and Buffy comes immediately to mind) but in that case the person who is being intimidated doesn’t usually close their eyes and lean almost imperceptibly forward into the caress.

Nuada is about to find the right book, so Nuala pulls the emergency alarm. She had to. Everyone shows up.

When Nuala calls Abraham by his name, Nuada freaks out on her and slices her cheek. I don’t think he sliced it out of anger at her, though that’s how it appears, he did it to keep Abe from coming closer towards them. He was making a show of threatening Nuala. Obviously he wouldn’t really kill her, because that would be suicide.

—–

There’s one moment during this library scene where Nuada is looking down at something on the table, and Nuala is standing behind him. He turns around to face her, and they’re so close… It was her choice. She was the one standing close to him. She was the one who let her face be so close to his.

Considering the fact that he just killed their father, she’s rather un-hostile towards him. She’s a little big angrier at the end, when Nuada is going to have Abraham killed. But you can’t blame her. If my brother killed my father and is about to kill my new friend, I’d be a little brassed off. And he’s not exactly gentle with her. But if he was too gentle, we’d forget he was the bad guy.

There isn’t much in the way of Nuala-Nuada business for the rest of the movie. Only two things really: as Nuala is dying and Abe confesses his love to her, she says that it is beautiful, but that’s all. She’s not in love with him! I would have liked to see her look at her brother as she was dying, but that’s OK. Nuada, though, looks at her during his final moments. I was worried he wouldn’t, but then he did. He expresses no anger at her for doing what she did. I think he admires it. His last words are unselfish: they’re a warning to Hellboy. Hellboy even catches him as he falls.

Anna Walton and Luke Goss - http://brightcove.vo.llnwd.net/d6/unsecured/media/So, I guess the question we have to ask ourselves is whether Nuala returns Nuada’s incestuous feelings. I say most definitely. I don’t think she can help it. She resists his plan, but she doesn’t resist him very well. Yeah, he’s kind of scary sometimes, but not in a bad way. And come on, Nuala and Abe? He’s aquatic, and wormish, and yeah, he’s smart and sensitive, but he’s not going to be winning any fights. As Anna Walton puts it: “No one seems to be happy for fishy and me.” Well, include myself.

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35 Responses to Hellboy II: The Golden Army

  1. Just found your site. I want to say that I totally picked up on the ‘cest vibe between these two as well. I like this movie a lot more than the first Hellboy for this exact reason. I’m a writer and always looking for a way to do incest without squicking my straight readers out. I have lots of what I call faux-incest books, (Amazon won’t let you pub a book on their site if it’s real incest) and I’m considering writing a new one based on the Cesare/Lucrezia relationship, which is how I found your site in the first place.
    Anyway, just wanted to say great posts. I am working my way through them now looking for new BSI movies and shows I haven’t seen before because I love this stuff. Do you have any books to recommend as well? Thanks.

    • Shipcestuous says:

      Welcome welcome welcome! I love getting lots of hits on the site, but I appreciate it so much more when even just one person finds here exactly what they were looking for.

      I didn’t know that about Amazon. I didn’t realize they allowed you to sell your own stuff there like that, but that kind of restriction strikes me as odd. I suppose they’re just trying to filter out the kink porn, but it’s not exactly fair.

      I know exactly what you mean about faux incest and trying not to squick out your readers. I do a fair amount of writing myself, though I start a lot more stories than I finish. In fact, I’m not sure I’ve even properly finished one. But I always want to put incest into them, and then I realize I would never be able to publish an oeuvre with that much incest. People would really start to wonder about me.

      More Cesare/Lucrezia is always welcome. I’m in the middle of watching the Borgia series that was made in Europe, quite coincidental timing. It’s on Netflix, though I’m not sure if there is any other way to watch it. I’m very disappointed so far – Cesare and Lucrezia are very different from their Showtime counterparts, but they’ve interacted very little, which almost seems historically inaccurate, though I’m not an expert.

      I’ve sought out plenty of books with incest in them, though I’ve been rather picky about which ones I actually took the time to read. Reading is so much more of a commitment than watching a movie. Also, I feel like the books tend to be a bit more depressing. I think authors more than scriptwrights feel the need to punish their characters for breaking the rules.

      There’s Cadavres, of course, which I even wrote a whole entry about, though I’m not sure if it’s available in English translation. My favorites are probably Diane Setterfield’s The Thirteenth Tale, John Irving’s The Hotel New Hampshire, George RR Martin’s A Song of Ice and Fire series (it’s incomplete at the moment), Salman Rushdie’s Midnight’s Children (adoptive incest), Maryse Conde’s Crossing The Mangrove, Philippa Gregory’s The Other Boleyn Girl ( and her Wideacre series, through I haven’t read it),

      Other books I’ve read with incest in them are The Cement Garden, Moon Tiger, A Spell of Winter, Flowers in the Attic, Jack and Josie.

      I’ll try and think of more. I try to keep up with the lists on Television Tropes and Idioms and Wikipedia, though I know they’re not comprehensive.

      Thanks for taking the time to comment. Please, always feel free to share your thoughts.

      • I have read/watched most of what you mention I think but I am going to check out some of the books I seem to have missed. I’m also going to order a copy of House of Wax which is something I never would have watched otherwise. I read your post on Cadavres and I think there is a movie you would like even more. I forget the name, sorry, but it does have actual consensual incest in it and it stars Clive Owen. Just Google Clive Owen incest and you should be able to find it.
        Yes, Amazon has some pretty strict rules about what they will publish. I have 4-5 faux incest books out and one of them, Forbidden, just won the paranormal erotica of the year award from TRS and us going into print. I day that not to brag but to prove that a lot of people are interested in cocensual BSI. I wish Amazon wasn’t so strict about it. Anyway, if I think of anymore movies/books, I’ll post to you. And I’ll be sure to tell you how I like House of Wax.

        • Shipcestuous says:

          Congratulations on your award! That’s wonderful. You should brag, you deserve to. But it is great to hear that there is a readership for that type of story. I started this blog because I knew there was an open niche for it.

          I know what you mean about House of Wax not being a movie you would have seen otherwise. I’ve definitely seen plenty of those in my search. Some of them I liked, some of them I didn’t.

          There are a lot of consensual brother/sister incest or (in my eyes) incest-tease movies and things that I have seen but I just haven’t done entries on yet, or even mentioned. I really should step it up, but they take a lot of work because I try to do a good job. I want to do a thorough enough job that the entry will be enjoyable even if someone hasn’t seen that movie or never intends to. But that takes a lot of time and energy.

          The Clive Owen movie you mentioned is a good example of that. It’s called Close My Eyes, and I’ve seen it quite a few times. It’s probably one of my favorite movies, just because it’s basically a romantic drama about a brother and sister who fall in love with each other, and it doesn’t take itself too seriously (in terms of repercussions) and there are consequences and a conclusion but it’s not apocalyptic. There’s a Argentine film called Geminis which is similar, but when the affair is discovered by their mother it wreaks utter havoc through their life. Over the top, I thought.

          Anyway, it’s great to hear from you again, and congratulations! Keep writing.

  2. Forgot to click the boxes below.

    • Yes, it irritates me that any film or book that deals with consensual BSI always has to end in tragedy. I like a happy ending, no matter who the characters end up with.
      I forgot to say that I have seen all of the European Borgias on Netflix and I’m afraid you’re going to be disappointed. First of all, Lucrezia and Cesare barely interact at all. Secondly I find her character to be incredibly vapid and annoying (maybe in part due to her weird, flat accent where she seems to swallow half her words.) There is one moment at the end of the last episode where they suddenly decide to go for it but since there isn’t that much affection between them in the first place, I didn’t find it very believable. I still thought the series was worth watching, however, mostly because of Cesare who is portrayed as incredibly complicated, conflicted, and possibly more than a little crazy by the very gifted and I thought, hot actor. And now back to looking for a copy of House of Wax. I don’t really want to watch it on my phone but on the other hand, I don’t want to wait for Amazon to ship it to me as a DVD. Sigh…

      • Shipcestuous says:

        I finished watching Borgia on Netflix. That scene in the final episode where Cesare and Lucrezia “go for it” as you put it, was very strange. On the one hand, I was kind of excited that there was some actual incest (especially after the Showtime Borgias, where nothing may ever happen), but it came completely out of nowhere. I didn’t find it quite believable either. I don’t regret watching the series, but I never devoted my full attention to it – I was always doing something else at the same time. I wish it could have been better.

  3. Misa says:

    Aww I´m so happy that I found your post about the twins *-*!!
    Seriously, I only watched the movie for exactly the same reason as you did xD!!
    Only saw the trailer and a bit of Nuada and decided to give it a try xD I still don´t like Hellboy, but only this pairing xD
    I´m hoping for a whole movie dedicated to the two of them T-T A prologue to Hellboy II would be great or a different ending T_T Maybe someday..if there are enough sponsors *-* One can still hope :’D

    Anyways, great post 🙂 !!

    • Shipcestuous says:

      I’m so glad you enjoyed reading what I wrote! Thank you! Nuada/Nuala is definitely the best part of the movie. A movie all about them would be as good as it gets. One can always hope, you’re right about that.

  4. Himitsu says:

    I’m glad I discovered your post. I enjoyed it. I saw Hellboy II for the first time today. I became a Hellboy fan the moment I learned of his love for cats, but quickly became a Prince Nuada fan after watching him practice/train. Plus, Nuada is not evil. I discovered a petition online to have a movie centered around him made. It would be a prequel for Hellboy II. Hidden Realm Entertainment even created a 3D trailer. In the trailer, they refer to Nuada and Nuala as a soul divided, which is pretty cool. It would be nice to see Prince Nuada and Princess Nuala together before the days of war and his exile. It would also be interesting to see how their relationship is depicted.

    I really liked the points you brought out. I did not think much of Nuada and Nuala’s relationship beyond a normal sibling connection until the library scene. The “twin connection” has been done plenty of times before, but the library scene made me look at their relationship in a different way. I must say I was quite intrigued by their relationship. Especially after, Nuada said, “Father always tried to shield your heart from mine”. Of course one can say that their father did not want Nuala to feel animosity toward humans like her brother or embrace a darker path, but the way Nuada was touching Nuala made me think the king was worried about something else ;).

    I really like what you said regarding Abraham and Hellboy singing, “I Can’t Smile Without You”. The song fit Nuada and Nuala better. I did like the way the music fadeout as soon as Nuala reached her hand. Then Nuada said her name. It was like there was no need for the song to continue because he was there. He was going to be with her. Of course, I maybe looking a little too deep into that transition :p

    I was disappointed in the end. I really wanted Hellboy to take Nuada to Nuala before they died. Maybe that’s one reason no one seemed happy for Nuala and Abraham. Even if some people don’t see Nuada and Nuala having anything other than a sibling love some people still wanted the twins to say good-bye to each other.

    • Shipcestuous says:

      Hi! Thank you so much for you comment! I’m really glad you enjoyed reading what I wrote.

      I would love a Nuada prequel movie so much. That would be amazing. I liked Nuada as a character a lot, but the relationship with Nuala makes him even better. “A soul divided” – I LOVE THAT. If that was how they wrote the relationship for the prequel it would make me so happy. They seemed to be on good terms when he came back in Hellboy II, so I feel like their relationship would be mostly a positive one.

      I love what you said about the song ending when Nuada and Nuala were together. That’s a great observation. Guillermo Del Toro is a very careful filmmaker and it may very well be that that was intentional. But even if it wasn’t, I still believe we’re free to interpret it that way, so I don’t think you’re looking too deep into it at all. I also like your interpretation of the line about their father shielding Nuala’s heart from Nuada’s. I’ll have to look for that next time. Since the incest subtext was intentional, I’m sure your interpretation is at the very least partially correct.

      I was disappointed in the end as well – a goodbye between them would have been so much better.

      Thanks again for your comment! It’s always fun to talk about Nuada and Nuala. The actress who played Nuala is on that new show Reign, and every time I see her I keep thinking about Nuala. It has made me want to rewatch the movie, and your comment made me want to rewatch it even more.

      • Himitsu says:

        Thanks for responding. Now I know I am not by myself and sailed by Nuala and Nuada ship too far.

        Unfortunately, the chances of a Nuada prequel are pretty slim according to Guillermo Del Toro. He and Luke Goss did like the idea of a prequel but the studio let’s just say, “HMM”. They are having trouble with getting Hellboy 3 secured.

        I am glad you like what I said about the song. I was a little caught up the library scenes. There’s something about libraries :). That’s why I so wanted Nuala to say to Nuada, “Be near me when I fade away,” from Tennyson’s In Memoriam. I was waiting for something like that to happen, but instead we got to watch her friendzone poor Abe. I am like you taking her response to Abe’s love as a positive for Nuada and Nuala. I am also taking it as a positive for Abe, “Tis better to have loved and lost
        Than never to have loved at all”(more Tennyson :)).

        I read that in the novelization of Hellboy Nuala and Nuada were seen as unattractive to other elves because of their facial scars. However, Nuada thought Nuala’s scars were beautiful. I wonder if he often told her that scars were beautiful. I wonder if he complimented her often. She did not seem surprised by his compliment about her wearing blue. It’s interesting you posted about Abe and Nuala being in blue while Hellboy and Nuada were in red. It was done on purpose. It brought balance. The fighters were in red and the peacekeepers in blue. However, I like that she knew Nuada would find her and she wore blue.

        I am glad I sparked your interest in seeing Hellboy II again. I think I’ll watch again when I get the chance. I heard radio commercials for Reign all this week.

        • Shipcestuous says:

          Ooh, that’s a fascinating bit of info from the novelization, though it’s hard to imagine anyone not finding Nuala pretty. I love the idea of their scars setting them apart.

          Yes, I’m sure the chances of the prequel are slim, though I think it’s great that people are even talking about it.

          “Be near me when I fade away.” Wow, that’s heartbreaking. It would have been so amazing if she had said something like that.

          Blue = peacemakers and red = warriors. Wow, great insight!

          Thanks for your comments! I have really enjoyed them.

  5. Jessie Situ says:

    Well i’m not sure if you are going to read this since it’s been so long, but Wow!! i put ur writing in my Favorites without hesitation right after reading it !! and i keep coming back and re-read it, it’s just awesome!! It’s so good and detailed, and i just love the twin as a couple. The only reason why i watched Hellboy is because i fell in love with the prince!! He is just so attractive from every side. And for sure his love for Nuala too. I didn’t remember if i realized his incestuous feelings towards Nuala before watching the movie or while watching the movie, but for sure i love him more because of this.

    Especially the library scene, and when he says “I can feel that much from you… Father always tried so hard to shield your heart from mine.” and strokes her cheek, and she closes her eyes and leans forward when his hands have left her face as if she wants him to touch her more and longer… and at sometime i just started to think that when people say something like “our hearts are closely locked together” it is really obvious that they are in love with each other, so when he says that “shield your heart from mine”, i think he is actually confessing his feeling towards her. Especially his expressions are just like “although father was always trying to set our hearts apart but it’s useless because our link is still so strong and I can still feel your feelings toward me.” and I paid special attention to this sentence because he said that “father tried to shield ‘HER’ heart from him” instead or “father tried to shield ‘his’ heart from her” which could mean that the king actually knows that he has feelings for her, but the king doesn’t want the princess return his feelings, so the king wants to shield her heart from him. Also he said “father always ‘TRIED’ so hard to shield your heart from mine.” which also could mean that their father didn’t succeed, and nuala does returned his feelings.

    Well, maybe i am going a little too deep and out of nowhere since none of the actors or del toro had ever confessed this or go this deep into this particular sentence, but that is really how i think. Also you mentioned that the song “can’t smile without you” is really more appropriate song for Nuada and Nuala, and I just have the exact same thought!! if you dig a little deeper into the lyrics and everything were all matched!! (sorry about my poor grammar…) I wrote a piece of short writing about how all the things between nuada and nuala are matching the song lyrics of “can’t smile without you ” in Chinese some time ago, and if you prefer i’ll write it again in english right here next time.

    It is so obvious that he does love s her more than just a sister. I watched the first Hellboy film just to understand the second one better, because i don’t want any confusions to distract me from the second movie. And i have to admit, Abe was my favorite character in the first film, he’s cute and sensitive and smart, but i definitely love Nuada way way way way way more than Abe and any other characters. i was totally into the twincest thing between Nuada and Nuala, i think it’s just the scene that makes the whole movie way more enjoyable than how it was.

    I was so happy when you said that Nuala actually returned his incestuous feelings cuz i was so depressed after watching the movie and when everyone says that the princess loves abe, and especially when they say she loves ave more than the prince!! But i guess they just didn’t seek deeper or more detailed into the movie like you did. There was some time that i kind of blame Nuala for what she did (not standing on his brother’s side and killed him in the end, u know.), cuz as for me, i think the prince isn’t a bad guy, instead he is a hero who would stand up and fight for his people. But then i realized how much the prince loves the princess and he didn’t blame her for what she did whatsoever, i decide not to blame the princess anymore also.

    I dunno why am i such a big fan of incest but i know that is what makes me love prince nuada even more, like, fell in love with his twin sister, it’s just awesome and adorable (i dunno what happened to my mind but that really is what i am thinking.)!!!!!! and Nuala and Abe… It’s just… so inappropriate. I mean… he’s a fish, and they are not even the same kind… it’s just… so weird!! Just like what luke said: “Even the incestuous thing that we had, is probably more appropriate than making out with a fish.” and i totally agree with this. I think the scene between the twins was too little, i really wish there could be more stories about Nuada and Nuala. yea, they make a perfect couple! whether it depends on how they look, how they dress, the way they are with each other, cultures, species… every single thing matches and it’s just such a pity that they died at the end, but that is also what makes the movie and these two characters so astounded. So yea, sorry about my bad grammar…=.=

    • shipcestuous says:

      Hello!

      Don’t worry, your comment was not lost, it’s still here! I moderate all comments and so I have to approve them before they get posted. It’s just a precautionary measure to keep hate off the blog, but it hasn’t really been an issue.

      Your grammar is just fine and I am happy that you wrote so much! I am so glad you enjoyed what I wrote about Nuada and Nuala!!! It has been quite a while since I’ve seen Hellboy II (something I need to rectify soon), so you’re definitely the expert right now. I am thrilled to get to discuss them with someone who is so enthusiastic about their relationship. You made a lot of really great points, thank you for sharing them here!

      That line about their father shielding Nuala’s heart from Nuada is really fascinating, isn’t it? I think your analysis is spot-on. It’s an ambiguous line, there’s no way to know exactly what he means, but all of the possibilities are great! It does seem like Nuala returned Nuada’s feelings and their father is trying to keep them apart. But their connection is just too strong.

      Abe and Nuala have a sweet relationship but he’s a fish so they don’t exactly make sense as a couple! I don’t know how that relationship – with a “guy” (fish-person) that she just met could ever compare to what she has with Nuada.

      I don’t blame Nuala for what she did – she was following her conscience. It’s a shame that it meant betraying her brother but she never stopped loving him. I think it’s very meaningful that they had to die together – their bond/link was just too much.

      Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts!

      • Jessie Situ says:

        Oh my I was so happy to see your response!! That made me jump all over the place (100 percent true!!) And it’s because I watched the movie recently and most of the people watched it years ago, and i think their passions were just killed by the time… so no one actually responded me at other places, and that breaks me heart 😦
        But thank you so much for reading it! 🙂 I hate how they died at the end but love it at the same time, it might be a bit weird but that’s really how I think, because their death scene made me love them 100 times more!! It’s really hard not to like both of the twins if you begin to like one of them. Anyway I just love your writing!! (Big Hearts XD)

        • shipcestuous says:

          Awww, I’m so glad you enjoyed my response. Yeah, it’s hard to care as much about something if it has been a long time since you’ve watched it, but I’ll love Nuada and Nuala forever.

          I’m with you about the ending. Even though it’s sad and complex, I also love it. You want them to be able to be together, but at the same time, the way they died just showed how special their bond was.

  6. Jessie Situ says:

    While watching the movie for the first time, I think that Nuada sliced Nuala’s face because he is jealous, but don’t quite understand it when he grabs blue books and say: “blue, you always look so beautiful in blue. Blue, poetry, love, found and lost. only words, I will find it.” And I had read some forum posts that says about that part. They say that he sliced her face because of jealousy and also out of fear of losing her. And for the part when he says “blue, you always look so beautiful in blue. Blue, poetry, love, found and lost. only words, I will find it.”, they say that “He seems so hurt there… as if Nuala once did proclaim her love for him (willingly or coerced), but then rejected him. Or… he could be taunting her for looking to ‘only words’ in a book to fulfill for her desire for love, instead of accepting the love he offered her. It is obvious from that scene that he does love her, though he may not show in the best of ways… he’s losing her, and will fight even harder for her – and his army – now.”

    Well yea, that’s what i found. But what do you think? ^_<

    • shipcestuous says:

      I’m feeling right now like I definitely need to rewatch in order to be able to answer this question. I think he slices her face just to show everyone how deeply connected they are, and yeah probably also because he’s jealous. I think he’s just waxing nostalgic when he talks about her looking beautiful in blue, and also hinting to the audience that he has incestuous feelings towards her. I think he’s hurt because he sees that she’s working with the other side. But its an interesting idea that perhaps she once rejected him, or they had a requited love and it ended. I like your idea about “only words” meaning she’s looking in the wrong place for love. The connection between them goes so far beyond words.

      It might just be showing off that he’s a thoughtful person, who cares about poetry and thinks like that. Not just a brute.

      • Jessie Situ says:

        yea i agree. Nuada is different from other villains whether it depends on positions, or personalities. I think he’s a hero for his people, and for personalities, normally villains are crazy, they are just mental and want to control the world or kill everyone without a reason. But Nuada…He is guy with… pathos.(yea i think that’s the right word to describe it.) I had always loved sentimental characters so much, and incestuous, of course.
        And you are totally right! He’s not a brute, i think he is really gentle(not to the humans)!! As I was doing research on Baidu (and I realized that people on Baidu usually don’t pay much attention to Nuada and Nuala and also their incest thing, and they don’t like incest… sad…T^T) for Hellboy 2 when i just finished watching the movie, i saw many movie introductions wrote Nuada as a brutal, cruel, and ruthless tyrant that would die anything and kill anything just to extinct the humankind. They described him as a crazy bad guy that is just completely insane. And this is just ridiculous… I have to say this, he is not brutal or cruel! I really like the scene where he killed the guards without sympathy but being so sweet to the dogs at the same time. Also the scene where he was working on the golden egg, and that little creature just ran to him and being so hectic and rushy describing what happened up on the market. A normal tyrant would be so impatient of this and shout right? Instead he was being so sweet and gentle and patient saying: “Is there something you need to tell me?” (That was so sweet!!) And how is is shocked and angry after he heard wink’s death, which means he is NOT ruthless! Yes, he killed his father, but his father tried to kill him in the first place. And of course he isn’t happy and regretted after he had done that. I can feel he almost cried while touching his father’s face, he doesn’t seem happy when he takes the crown piece either. I do believe him and I think everyone does since it’s so obvious that it’s true when he says “i always loved you, father.”

        • shipcestuous says:

          Yes, I agree. Nuada is ruthless towards the humans but he is not a psychopath or evil. He believes he is justified. His mission is to protect. He is without a doubt a grey figure and not a black and white villain.

  7. just re-watched the movie and reread your blog post. I noticed that you said:” I would have liked to see her look at her brother as she was dying, but that’s OK. Nuada, though, looks at her during his final moments. I was worried he wouldn’t, but then he did.” in your writing and i found some interesting fact today while watching the movie: Nuala is looking at Nuada while she stabs herself and falls on the ground while Nuada is talking to Hellboy and before Abe picks her up. So they did look at each other while they are dying, just at different times… i guess that comforts me a LOT.

  8. I got some information today that quite bothers me…which is that during a interview the movie guy asked if Nuala has the same feeling as Nuada has for her, then both Luke and Anna said no… Curiously the first thing that came to my mind was to come here and ask you how you think. I’ve read all those before but I just didn’t want to believe it. Since in my opinion the princess really does returned the prince’s feeling she just didn’t realize that, or her love for him is more like a family affection but at least it contains a bit of incestuous love. But it’s still kinda hurt when Anna and Luke just say “no”. But are actor’s opinions really “facts”? i know most of the time they are but sometimes we tend to sense something else that the actors presented but didn’t realize by themselves or we just simply sense different things.
    I am pretty sure that Nuala didn’t fell for Abe for now, there is another interview when the movie guy asked:” can you talk to us about the relationship Nuala has with Abe Sabien? You’re his love interest?”
    and Anna replied: “Yea, well I can’t say too much(I’m not sure if Anna’s “I” here means herself or Nuala, if she means Nuala that definitely means Nuala isn’t in love with Abe, but I think either way proves that), but it’s very lovely for Abe actually.” and at the end she said :” She(Nuala) doesn’t dip into his(Abe) tank for any hanky-panky.” I”m not quite sure what does that “hanky-panky” means but I’m pretty sure it supports the idea that Nuala doesn’t love abe. Anna also pointed out that Nuala’s relationship with her brother is really important for her, and he is almost a part of her but she had to break away… You know that’s how it confuses me since the actors seems to stand for different things and have counter claims for what they said before or after.
    I think I’m taking this too seriously, I love them too much. I would probably act like i was dying if this happens a month ago, but now i’m still kind of hurt.
    and just another thing i want to mention, did you ever write about Narnia? If you did I didn’t find it. I think it is really cute for Lucy whether if she pairs up with Edmund or Peter. and Peter is just so protective of her in the movie. For Susan hmmm, i wasn’t a big BSI shipper when i first watched the movies a (long) while ago, so i kind of liked her with caspian instead of her brothers. But lucy is just good with any of her brothers.

    • shipcestuous says:

      Yes, I can understand why you are bothered, and I am too. But even though it’s always nice to hear the actors say things that support the relationships we like, what’s really important is what is actually in the movie. So even though it’s great to hear from the actor who plays Nuada that he has incestuous/romantic feelings towards Nuala, and to get that confirmation from him, if we disagree with the actors about something else, that’s OK. Theirs is not the word of God. What we interpret from the movie is what’s important, and what’s clear from the movie is that Nuada matters a great deal to Nuala, and that even though she tries to stop him, she loves him.

      I’m not sure what the exact wording of the interview is, but it’s possible that even though Nuala doesn’t return the exact same kind of feelings that Nuada has, that doesn’t mean she doesn’t still have incestuous feelings of some kind for him. Whatever they said, I’m sure there’s still some wiggle room for interpretation.

      When the actress says that she doesn’t “dip into his tank for any hanky-panky”, she’s mainly saying that Nuala and Abe don’t have sex. It really doesn’t answer the question about her feelings one way or another. But even though Abe and Nuala have a connection, I don’t think at all that she is in love with them.

  9. I bought the art of the movie and saw something interesting in it…during that library scene, when Nuada said: “You move, and I’ll kill your Abraham first.” I had always thought that he was saying this to Hellboy because he was jealous of Abe and Nuala, and wanted Hellboy to step aside and kill Abe first, but in the art of the movie, there was a original script. Nuada was saying that to Nuala, if she dared to move, he’ll kill her Abraham first. He was so possessive, he was ordering her, I think she would obey him all the time when they used to be closer. And it could tell they were very close, and inseparable from the movie since every time when Nuala “betrayed” her brother, when she did something against him, he was always surprised and hurt, as if he didn’t believe that she would do this to him. Especially when Nuala pulled the alarm, he was holding her wrist and asked her why, he was so shocked and hurt and even under that kind of condition-when she was against him, when she JUST did something to “betray” him- he was thinking of leaving WITH her. He held her and was going to take her out of here with him, habitually(I think).

    I didn’t like the original script too much, the novelization was wrote according to this script, but it hardly described any incestuous things between the twins, there was no nose bleeding scene, and the most important part when Nuada caressed the sister’s face and tell her that father always tried to shield her heart from his. And Nuada didn’t look at Nuala while he died nor “Nuala, my sister”being his final words. It felt as if they absolutely don’t love each other, the Prince was more brutal to the Princess in the original script. And the Princess was also more rejected to the Prince.
    She said “No – no – he’s here.” in the original script when she sensed Nuada’s coming. I’m glad they changed it to “He’s here.” and take away the “no no” part in the movie, because in the movie it felt like Nuala really wanted him but didn’t wanted him, she was fighting with her own will.

    But there are parts that were rather interesting, they were described as “yin and yang, almost the same being”, and when Nuada sliced Nuala’s face, it was described like this:
    “The Prince cuts her cheek——deep. The skin of his cheek bends and bleeds too!! He smiles.”
    I like how he smiled, he was so possessive. It felt like he was showing off their link, and letting everyone know that he was the one who had the dominant power.
    When the Princess stabbed herself, and this was the time when Nuada said “Nuala——sister——” in the original script, and it continued to describe: “They share a last look of mutual understanding. Love and hatred.” Glad they finally revealed that they do love each other, although it carried hatred somehow, but it made their love deeper somehow too. Since their love was more complex and all, although I don’t quite understand when it said “mutual understanding”, understanding of what?

    In the movie I also didn’t quite understand it when Nuada opened the blue books and said to the Princess:”Poetry, love, found and lost. Only words, I will find it.”(This part also did not appear in the original script!!!) I’m sure there’s so much to dig about them and their words.. I did find someone’s opinions about this part on a forum, it said:
    “He seemed so hurt there…as if Nuala once did proclaim her love for him (willingly or coerced), but then rejected him. Or…he could have been taunting her for looking to ‘only words’ in a book to fulfill her desire for love, instead of accepting the love he offered her. It is obvious from that scene that he does love her, though he may not show it in the best of ways.” I think it might be true but it still feel kind of far…I think he did mean Nuala’s love for him when he said “found and lost”, but I’m not sure about the “only words” part.

    • shipcestuous says:

      Thank you so much for telling me about the novelization and the Art of the Movie book, and the original script. I sometimes forget those things exist but they often hold very interesting or shippy clues. Though in this case, it sounds like what’s actually in the movie is the shippiest of all. I’m a little disappointed to hear that, but I’m also glad. I find it very interesting that so much was added/changed during filming and editing. I wonder if it was the chemistry between the actors and seeing them in costume next to each other that led to some of the more incestuous and loving bits? I would like to think so, if it wasn’t intended originally.

      I think the “mutual understanding” could both come from Nuala understanding what Nuada’s goals are and what he’s willing to accomplish his goals, and also just from them both recognizing how deep their connection is. I don’t think they ever felt hatred towards each other. Maybe they hated what the other one was doing, but I don’t think they could ever hate them.

      I love how he smiles when his cheek bleeds too. He knows that if they care about Nuala they won’t hurt him or else she’ll be hurt too, but even more importantly I agree with you, he’s just really proud about his link to Nuala, and he’s shoving it in Abe’s face too.

      It has been quite a while now since I’ve seen this movie. I’m still meaning to rewatch it, though. I want to very much, I just haven’t done it. But anyway, I don’t quite remember the details of when Nuada threatens Abe, but I do think that maybe I assumed he was speaking to Nuala. I think it’s important that he’s addressing her, in a way ignoring the others. And holding Abe against her, showing her that Nuada doesn’t like him.

      Thank you for more thoughts and discussion! I love that you are still thinking about Nuada/Nuala so much!

      • Thanks for replying, I prefer to believe that they never hated each other, their love never carried hatred, at least it’s what was shown in the movie. But the script in the art of the movie said “love and hatred” anyhow. This was definitely not the script they played in the movie because it doesn’t really contain incestuous love between the twins. I really liked the idea of “if it was the chemistry between the actors and seeing them in costume next to each other that led to some of the more incestuous and loving bits? ” you said and it would be so cool and awesome if it’s that way. But I remember Anna and Luke saying that they both picked up the fact of Nuada’s incestuous feelings towards Nuala while reading the script, so there should be another revised script that they actually played for the movie. I guess why they keeped the original script in the art of the movie and the novelization was because there were some interesting ideas or something guillermo(or someone else) wanted to show us. But I really love the idea if it was the chemistry between the actors, it’s still possible and I would love it so much if it really is that way. And yes I love the Prince and the Princess forever 🙂

  10. shiyingxiaoxiao says:

    Oh god, for the last question, about the only words,
    u actually explained the same exact problem already in the earlier comments. Sorry, my bad, just ignore it 😉

  11. olivia says:

    I just finished watching Blade II yesterday, and I’m quite interested in the relationship between Nyssa and Nomak. I know that Nyssa and Blade had some romantic feelings for each other, but I also think that Nomak had something for his sister too. As a brother-sister shipper I always look at siblings in films and books in the shippest of way, so my own opinion might twist the “correct” thing that the movie tried to represent. While watching I kept comparing Nomak with Nuada and clearly they have many more similarities besides portraying by the same actor. Luke did a good job portraying them. I wouldn’t be surprised if Guillermo has the intention of showing something between Nomak and Nyssa, since Guillermo also had a thing for brother and sister relationships, although in Blade II it might not be as obvious as it in Hellboy II and Crimson Peak. But there are some rather suspicious scenes, such as when Nyssa and Blade were hunting for the Reapers, Nomak showed up from nowhere and covered Nyssa’s mouth when she was alone, when Blade found them, Nomak wasn’t covering Nyssa’s mouth anymore but he was kind of holding Nyssa from the back and whispering her something to her ear (I’m not sure if he was really saying something).It’s a really sensual gesture, and their distance is really close. Even closer than Nuada and Nuala when Nuada sliced his sister’s cheek. There are more, when Blade and Nyssa were together sharing a quite “romantic” scene(when Blade cut himself and use his blood to heal Nyssa), Nomak was staring at them at a distant place, and also when Nyssa offered her neck to Nomak, he sort of caressed her a little before biting her. Blade II was similar with Hellboy II for the brother-and-sister-death part when the brother died and turned into ashes while the sister lied in someone’s arms turn into stone/ashes.

    I’m not sure if Nyssa knew that Nomak was her brother before she met him, I’m not even sure if she knew that she had a brother. because her reactions were quite strange, when her father revealed that Nomak was actually his son, she seemed surprised and hurt and felt betrayed that her father would use his own children, I mean doesn’t her brother live with them? Doesn’t she suspect anything when her brother just disappeared? Or she never knew that she had a brother? But it wouldn’t make sense, they clearly knew each other, and Nomak was also jealous of how Nyssa had more of their father’s love(before biting her Nomak said “you were his favorite”).

    • shipcestuous says:

      It has been a lifetime since I’ve seen Blade II. I really need to revisit that series. The comparisons you made with Nuada/Nuala are very interesting. Nyssa/Nomak has come up before on my tumblr, here. Everything you’ve listed makes the relationship seem very suggestive, and you’re not alone in thinking so. You’re quite right about Guillermo Del Toro – he seems to have quite an interest in brother/sister relationships and in incestuous ones too. I would not be at all surprised if he meant to hint at something with Nyssa and Nomak.

      Thank you for sharing your thoughts! I’m sorry I can’t talk about them in more detail.

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